/dup/ - btfo

You're preaching to the converted, state this on some normalfag social media website.
Nobody was talking about "Judeo-Christian" values in decades past.
It was always European Christian values.

Christianity in the form of Catholicism was indeed involved in forging our civilization, however, the aspect of Catholicism thst made it was the Roman Pagan Aspect that allowed the religion to unify most of Western Europr during the middle ages, not the Jewish Root that was always its failing and ended up being the West's undoing, think the reformation and mercy to the Jews.

>>165513
>mercy to the Jews
christianity has caused both, it's pretty complex
on the one hand christianity led to jews being evicted from the european countries, most clearly in the case of Spain, when they evicted the Jews in 1492, beginning the Spanish golden age.
on the other hand Oliver Cromwell allowed the Jews back into England in 1656 after they were expelled in 1290. It seems his motive was that he was hoping that- since Jews are said to play a role in bringing about the antichrist in the Book of Revelation- allowing the Jews to settle in England would hasten the apocalypse.

>>165505
>and not "anglo-franco" values that was the previously established and agreed core set of beliefs.
When was that ever something that was pushed? Serious question.
>germanic values (sorry nazdups, but it amounted to nothing and failed every time it was tried, harsh truth cold fact)
Are you actually talking Germanic values or German values specifically? Nazi racial ideology was definitely spergy and way too harsh, but I wouldn't say it's inevitable for a German nationalist movement to wind up that way (although, for whatever reason, Germany seems to have problems doing anything in moderation).

As far as the U.S. is concerned, I think something broadly Germano-Celtic but also French inclusive should be emphasized as the national culture. That to me strikes a good balance between the excessively broad "melting pot" view of America and the overly narrow stance of hard-line Anglo-Saxonists. It recognizes America as the product of certain genetic and cultural influences without being needlessly divisive. I'm not saying that other whites should be made to feel unwelcome or not have their contributions recognized, but some groups have been more important than others in building a national identity and ought to be recognized as such.
>>165514
>on the other hand Oliver Cromwell allowed the Jews back into England in 1656 after they were expelled in 1290. It seems his motive was that he was hoping that- since Jews are said to play a role in bringing about the antichrist in the Book of Revelation- allowing the Jews to settle in England would hasten the apocalypse.
I'm not sure the Royalists were any better:
https://racehist.blogspot.com/2010/02/basic-facts-concerning-oliver-cromwell.html

>>165505
the US has been founded on Christianity from the very beginning considering the initial pilgrims were rejected from the UK for their Christian beliefs. Anti-Christian sentiment is always kikery.

>>165514
>It seems his motive was that he was hoping that- since Jews are said to play a role in bringing about the antichrist in the Book of Revelation- allowing the Jews to settle in England would hasten the apocalypse.
keeeeeek

>>165520
>the US has been founded on Christianity from the very beginning
Incorrect. Christianity was the most common religious affiliation, but America wasn't founded as a theocracy.
>considering the initial pilgrims were rejected from the UK for their Christian beliefs.
It was the specific variety of Christianity they followed that was the point of contention. It wasn't just being Christian. Also, the religious fervor of the Pilgrims and Puritans had died decades before the time of the American Revolution. Those were also only two groups of settlers. Jamestown was settled earlier, and its colonization was motivated by economic interests.
>worshiping the King of the Jews is always kikery.
Fixed.

>>165522
complete pilpul. It was founded on Christianity CONSIDERING the pilgrims were rejected on their Christian beliefs - those being their CHRISTIAN BELIEFS - as in their BELIEFS ABOUT CHRISTIANITY
typical illiterate kike. Denounce the talmud.

>>165530
>It was founded on Christianity CONSIDERING the pilgrims were rejected on their Christian beliefs - those being their CHRISTIAN BELIEFS - as in their BELIEFS ABOUT CHRISTIANITY
And America wasn't founded on their highly specific theological views, dummy. That's especially true of the Puritans, who were more intolerant overall than the Pilgrims.

One idea that did catch on was the idea of separation of church and state, which was something John Lothropp promoted. The Founding Fathers themselves held a mix of Christian and deistic influences, and Thomas Jefferson was an unorthodox Christian at best. The United States was not founded on Christianity.
>typical illiterate kike
Have you even read any of the Bible? Or did you just embrace JESUS CHROIST because of BASED e-crusader images you saw on /pol/ or Twatter?
>Denounce the talmud.
I reject both the Written Torah and the Oral Torah that grew out of it, as well as the King of the Jews that you worship.

>>165535
That spic bears resemblance to the 2nd Charlotte train stabber.

Judeo-Christian values is the proper term for it, it is an alien poison to European sensibilities. Look at what the buybull has led our people to. The issue isn't retvrn to tradition of catholicism/orthodox or good old ole-time religion or whatever nonsense the jew inside your mind has cooked up. We have to reject all abrahamic faith as the subversive jewish poison it is and think for ourselves. You don't need a holy book or a man in the sky to tell you how to think and behave, this is slave morality. Our people can not free ourselves from the chains of the jews using books and worldviews entirely contained within the judaic rabbi framework. Think outside the black cube, slave. Or die

>>165541
>murderer
That's no way to obtain a Chestnut of Righteousness.
>>165545
And the thing is that when you get right down to it, it's pretty clear that the historicity of the Bible is highly dubious at best. I understand that for a lot of people there are emotional attachments to Christianity involved, and knowing what that's like I genuinely feel sorry about that, but there's not much in the way of compelling evidence they have to win people over with. The Bible being based on fake stories is enough of a reason for me to reject it even leaving the fact that it's the basis for a messed-up, antiwhite value system created by weirdo Middle-Easterners and their goons.

>>165535
it's really funny that we're arguing in both threads

>>165549
I also feel sorry for people who can't let it go from an emotional attachment. A lot of people get raised into it young and its very manipulative. Continued effort towards freeing yourself from christianity is possible and not as hard as some would have you believe! About the veracity of the bible and it being fake or not. My position is that, even if it were true, it promotes pacifism, antinatalism, and destruction of the family unit and destroys kinship with the Folk in favour of the alien values of the jewish race. Its slave morality for us, but then Talmudic powergrabs, interest on money, live it up now now now make it big lifestyle for the jews. The christians brought jews into Europe to handle money, and we're still dealing with the consequences of that foolish decision to this day. So the bible told them, "jews are just better than you with money". So they didn't loan money to their friends on interest, kikes did, and then we get (((Venice))) and the (((Dutch East India Company))) and (((City of London))) and on and on down the line. Fuck the values of the bible. We handle our own money, we deal with our own people, Europeans first and foremost and to hell with the rest. Following christian morality just leads to the grave. The Virtues of our Folk make one strong, hardy, and full of real empathy and not the snake-like false empathy of the bible. Anything offered for free, especially including "salvation", should be rejected whole-cloth because things offered for free always come with a hidden cost.

>>165555
It's been a while since I've had a Christian sparring partner on here to argue with.
>>165556
>I also feel sorry for people who can't let it go from an emotional attachment. A lot of people get raised into it young and its very manipulative.
I was raised in an evangelical environment by parents who got into that sort of thing when they were growing up, and I think that's the case for them. It's not something they can let go of. I sometimes have friendly arguments with my dad, and recently he made a comment that stood out to me. I don't quite remember how he phrased it. I think it was something to the effect that how if there's no higher power to ground ourselves on and everything comes down to naked power games, then we're in big trouble. That sounds to me like a fear of having to face the abyss, which I think is a fear a ton of people who are used to building their conceptions of reality and philosophy for navigating it on the rigid frames of organized religion systems share.

As much as I rag on Christians for being obnoxious and retarded, a lot of them are good people at heart who have been brainwashed or conditioned to have spiritual Stockholm Syndrome.
>Continued effort towards freeing yourself from christianity is possible and not as hard as some would have you believe!
I gave it up toward the end of high school, and that was the worst year of my life. Maybe in retrospect it's a good thing that I left the way I did, because it was like quickly tearing the band-aid off. I had a phase where I was even flirting with materialistic existential nihilism before settling on idealism, and I feel like that made me stronger. I now can comfortably face a lot of ideas that other people find deeply unsettling. I think that probably makes me a bit too prone to going in like a wrecking ball when it comes to differences in beliefs when I should be a bit less aggressive and be more open to putting myself in someone else's shoes.

I didn't even have any awareness of racial issues or the Jewish Question at the time, but parting ways with Christianity made me less resistant to accepting all the Abrahamic religions as Semitic poison once I learned more about those topics.

Honestly, I think the main reason I stayed Christian for as long as I did was just the fear of hell. The idea of eternal torture is a messed-up thing to put into the heads of children, but unfortunately so many Christians believe that they're helping kids in the long run by doing it.

>>165557
>I think it was something to the effect that how if there's no higher power to ground ourselves on and everything comes down to naked power games, then we're in big trouble. That sounds to me like a fear of having to face the abyss
I was raised agnostic and to me, I can't understand this fear at all. The abyss, nihilism, inherent meaninglessness fuels me to create and add colour to life. Its oddly comforting at times. I don't think life is an abyss, just the idea, the concept, is good to power passion and creativity.
>As much as I rag on Christians for being obnoxious and retarded, a lot of them are good people at heart who have been brainwashed or conditioned to have spiritual Stockholm Syndrome.
They can be good people at heart all they want but without understanding of the JQ and the racial fight we find ourselves in, I wouldn't trust them. An insidious, de-clawed enemy, but enemy nonetheless unless they can de-program themselves.
>I gave it up toward the end of high school, and that was the worst year of my life. Maybe in retrospect it's a good thing that I left the way I did, because it was like quickly tearing the band-aid off.
Its always best to rip the band-aid off and get things over with quickly, yeah.
>I now can comfortably face a lot of ideas that other people find deeply unsettling.
Same.
>I think that probably makes me a bit too prone to going in like a wrecking ball when it comes to differences in beliefs when I should be a bit less aggressive and be more open to putting myself in someone else's shoes.
Theres nothing wrong with the wrecking ball approach as long as its not the only tack you ever take. Theres a time for nuance as well, but I feel like after 2020 clear lines in the sand have been drawn and the time for the wrecking ball is now more than ever. Kali Yuga
>I now can comfortably face a lot of ideas that other people find deeply unsettling.
So I find this to be a great strength in my life personally and all that knowledge has turnt to wisdom as I age. Knowledge has to be practically applied to develop into wisdom. I eschew taboos and social mores and like direct people who talk about big ideas, events, concepts. Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette. Being raised in a non-religious house, I explored all the different world religions and many different spiritual things as a teenager and young adult and that gradually led me to Paganism, and racial realism. Ancestor worship and a mix of Pantheism, I guess is the best way of describing my beliefs.
>if there's no higher power to ground ourselves on and everything comes down to naked power games, then we're in big trouble
This reminds of the Hitler quote about the Life-affirming realities of struggle and of Nature. The one about how, paraphrasing, struggle is what makes a man strong and is an ever-present reality of Life. It can either beat you down, or it can build you up, but theres nothing inherently evil or bad and scary about it at all. Its just Nature. I'd rather sharpen my claws and study Power and how to play the power game than submit to some 'god' that may or may not care.
>be more open to putting myself in someone else's shoes.
Many people in this world will use empathy as a sign of weakness. Not everybody, but I think its clear by now who's friend and who's foe and we can safely kinda act accordingly.
>The idea of eternal torture is a messed-up thing to put into the heads of children, but unfortunately so many Christians believe that they're helping kids in the long run by doing it.
Its incredibly macabre and twisted and if anything it just plants the seed of apostasy and teenage rebellion in them, lul.
>Honestly, I think the main reason I stayed Christian for as long as I did was just the fear of hell.
I suspect this the case for most christians. The jews control us all thru anger and thru fear. Righteous anger is Just and Right, but we should rid ourselves of fear. "Fear is the mind-killer, I shall not fear". Am glad you got out of that religion like you did. It can ruin people.

Personally, as someone with zero philisophical interest in anything that lots of the discussion of the abyss or whatever goes over his head, I just never, and I mean even when I first had it explained to me when I was like 8, never understood the appeal of the jesus story.

Obviously there is one, it's probably the single event in human history that's spawned the most art and poetry and paintings and whatever, so clearly it hits a chord for lots and lots of white people but hot damn it never did in my case.

To fix a thing god made, original sin, god made one son we're all his children but apparantly that only sorta counts, this one was his one son and not you, okay?, had him go through a bunch of trials and perform some miracles and recruit some apostles and all that, which had to have been pre-ordained since god is the one orchestrating this whole pageant. Then has him killed but then psych not really he's better after a bit but then lolno not really he's gone again. And that freed you from original sin, because god made god 2: human version and then did some arbitrary stuff in the levant for a few years.

I don't get it. That's not inspiring. That doesn't really make sense. If it were a script you'd reject it because it doesn't even flow as a story. Why only make one jesus? Why not do another jesus every, i dunno, century so that people would stop doubting the veracity of any of it? Why not have it rain jesuses constantly, right now, that's certainly shut nonbelievers up. Why do all this shit so far before videos/photographs/even reliable written records existed that there really isn't much to go on other than "trust me bro"?

Why did anything jesus even do lead to the outcome of "saving man from sin"? Why did he even have to do anything at all, like why was this a problem to begin with?

My autistic little kid brain looked at it and thought like, the game developer noticed a glitch, and then to patch the glitch he had to create an avatar in the game and play through it a bit before dying to patch it. Why the hell would you even do that? Why not just patch the glitch? What's the point? And why does this resonate with hundreds of millions to billions of people throughout time?

>>165565
>I didn't get it
You aren't meant to get it, Christians themselves just say more often than not that the one thing that separates it from myth is that its le heckin' real, but it isn't. There brains have been so brow-beaten by jewish bullshit that it lives rent free inside their heads eternally.

Requesting the cartoon with Yahweh depicted as the Happy Merchant nose getting bullied in school by the other gods and doing a school shooting. Can't find it anywhere online.

>>165570
I got it somewhere but sadly I don't have it labeled.

>>165570
If I pull your nose off, will you die?
Thats a big nose.
For you

Honestly its even crazier when one realizes that the whole Yaweh being the one and the all, the true God is just the Jews reading Platonism and grafting it onto their religion to give him more power.

>>165573
Thanks, this is one of /pol/'s greatest hits imo.

>>165560
>I was raised agnostic and to me, I can't understand this fear at all. The abyss, nihilism, inherent meaninglessness fuels me to create and add colour to life. Its oddly comforting at times. I don't think life is an abyss, just the idea, the concept, is good to power passion and creativity.
I think existence is more like a giant sandbox than anything. Maybe there's some kind of moral code involved, but even that I'm not sure of. I definitely don't believe there's some laundry list of dos and don'ts to adhere to.
>They can be good people at heart all they want but without understanding of the JQ and the racial fight we find ourselves in, I wouldn't trust them. An insidious, de-clawed enemy, but enemy nonetheless unless they can de-program themselves.
I'm not saying they can be trusted in regard to anything involving race at all. Listening to CQ Radio for a while showed me that even "pro-white Christians" are largely incapable of being trusted. Most will put their religion over their race. And if they don't, then how Christian are they really?
>Theres nothing wrong with the wrecking ball approach as long as its not the only tack you ever take. Theres a time for nuance as well, but I feel like after 2020 clear lines in the sand have been drawn and the time for the wrecking ball is now more than ever. Kali Yuga
>Many people in this world will use empathy as a sign of weakness. Not everybody, but I think its clear by now who's friend and who's foe and we can safely kinda act accordingly.
I mean in the sense that you can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. And while I do try to have empathy for pragmatic reasons, I also try to be patient and respectful for its own sake if people are willing to reciprocate. On the other hand, the hammer does need to be brought down on ignorant retards who shoot off their mouths thinking they're a lot smarter than they are. Not that I'm even that smart.
>So I find this to be a great strength in my life personally and all that knowledge has turnt to wisdom as I age. Knowledge has to be practically applied to develop into wisdom. I eschew taboos and social mores and like direct people who talk about big ideas, events, concepts. Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette. Being raised in a non-religious house, I explored all the different world religions and many different spiritual things as a teenager and young adult and that gradually led me to Paganism, and racial realism. Ancestor worship and a mix of Pantheism, I guess is the best way of describing my beliefs.
I've always been into paranormal subjects, and that to me was one of the biggest factors that led to me throwing in the towel on Christianity. When you do enough digging, you can't help but come across things that totally contradict the claims of religions like Christianity and point you to other directions regarding the nature of reality. A lot of people into "woo" are leftists and claim that biology doesn't really matter. I think consciousness is more fundamental to reality than the material, but I definitely am not someone who rejects biology. The people who do so can't seem to come up with an actionable solution to dealing with innate racial differences in a dog-eat-dog world where game theory applies. Most of them seem to still be stuck on assuming that differences between individuals or populations mainly come down to environment and are just whistling past the graveyard. How are you supposed to solve a problem if you're not even willing to face it in the first place?

I'm definitely more sympathetic to paganism than Abrahamic religions, but I wouldn't call myself a pagan either. I just have appreciation for the gods and stories our ancestors came up with and think the the aesthetics are appealing, too.
>This reminds of the Hitler quote about the Life-affirming realities of struggle and of Nature. The one about how, paraphrasing, struggle is what makes a man strong and is an ever-present reality of Life. It can either beat you down, or it can build you up, but theres nothing inherently evil or bad and scary about it at all. Its just Nature. I'd rather sharpen my claws and study Power and how to play the power game than submit to some 'god' that may or may not care.
The idea of life being endless struggle isn't one that appeals to me, but it might be true. I don't think there's any reason to believe it couldn't also hold true on planes of existence other than this one. Too many people seem to believe that once they're dead they'll be guaranteed an existence of blissful lotus eating and not have to worry about being taken advantage of by other beings. I'd rather keep my guard up here and in any possible existence after death. I question the motives of anyone who encourages others to engage in "toxic positivity" and completely cast aside wariness and suspicion. "Our differences don't matter. We're all one, man. We all just need to love each other!" Yeah, well, under a monistic framework me and a giant centipede are one, too. That doesn't mean I'm going to want to have anything to do with one. There has to be some level of nuance.
>I suspect this the case for most christians. The jews control us all thru anger and thru fear. Righteous anger is Just and Right, but we should rid ourselves of fear. "Fear is the mind-killer, I shall not fear".
I think the Christians who promote annihilationism or universal salvation are doing the rest of us a service. The more heavily you cut out a doctrine like that, the more people will feel like they have permission to leave the plantation.
>Am glad you got out of that religion like you did. It can ruin people.
I have older relatives who've bought into the whole nine yards. The Jews are the chosen people, going "witnessing" or on mission trips (or attending religious events elsewhere), race mixing is fine, etc. It's sickening and depressing the way so many of them have been hoodwinked.
>>165565
>I mean even when I first had it explained to me when I was like 8, never understood the appeal of the jesus story.
I never truly liked Jesus either. I was always more into the Old Testament warriors as a kid, like Samson, Gideon, and David. I just felt like Jesus was my get-out-of-hell-free card and had to be respectful.
>I don't get it. That's not inspiring. That doesn't really make sense.
It really is nonsensical. It's a soteriological Rube Goldberg machine.
>Why did anything jesus even do lead to the outcome of "saving man from sin"? Why did he even have to do anything at all, like why was this a problem to begin with?
Letting himself be killed somehow saves us from something Yahweh knew about and allowed to happen if he's supposed to be both omniscient and omnipotent.
>>165573
Beat me to it.
>>165575
That certainly seems more likely to me than the Greeks reading the Bible and borrowing from the Mosaic, which is what Philo seriously argued. The chutzpah goes back a long way.
>>165584
Yeah, it's a classic. Besides how butthurt Yahweh comes across, the whole concept of the messiah sort of creates a Revenge of the Nerds scenario when you think about it. The Jews had been constantly getting swirlies from the Egyptians (according to the Bible, anyway), Assyrians, Babylonians, the Greek Ptolemaics and Seleucids, and the Romans for not worshiping Yahweh hard enough; but then the day is saved when a deus ex machina happens that helps puts the Jews in the Chads' place and show them who's boss. It's so clearly a wish fulfillment fantasy fueled by the resentment of spiteful dweebs who had been getting their clocks cleaned by everyone around them.

>>>165596
Always fun watching the various chuds of pagan to agnostic origin deconstructing reality. I'm not entirely sure you can just torch thousands of years if history and not cut out a large chunk of the white man with it. As a side note any particular moral framework any of you prefer if we're going to dump the now completely decoupled from religion framework of humanism and individual liberty?

>reality
religion.

I should add that all religion will come off as some degree of bunk when you apply the anglo rationalist view to it but ultimately people need meaning so robbing people of it with nothing of substance to replace it is not a winning move.

>>165604

This is obviously true, and the sorta non-diestic religion that is american liberal democracy is obviously very bad. Problem was the white man did in fact have its own religion and now it's been so battered and beaten by abraham's henchmen that that's become the default for 99 percent of white people that are inclined towards religion that has a spiritual non-corporal diety in essence not niggers like the american state religion has

>>165607
See here's the thing; I've never understood the notion that this was imposed on white people by some nascent outside force. Unless you want to insist that the various religious schism and upheaval in the roman empire was orchestrated by a people that had somehow miraculously organised an empire wide network with deep influence after basically being butcher, enslaved and then shipped to the four corners of the empire.

I really do think it was just the most philosophically compelling at the time, especially as to how it fused with pervious Greek philosophical beliefs.

>>165607
But more broadly this just leads me back to this question posed to the thread >>165602.

>>165571
Meanwhile, back in non-revisionist reality / historical fact.

>>165612
Based. Nazis saw their women as broodmares and baby factories.

>>165602
What, like how Abrahamism torched thousands of years of white history, and pretty much nothing changed other than the shape of the stick that being worshiped, and that the infrastructure had to be rebuilt from scratch. The Christians in Greece and Rome mined from the old buildings, because they were incapable of sourcing from their own quarries. Defacing the statues was a separate religious practice entirely, and done out of fear of the statue itself moreso than spite.

> thousands of years
Christendom only held dominance in Europe from ~1,000 AD, and even then there were significant pockets of resistance like in the Kyvian Rus and Ireland. Cut the "'s", it was barely 1 millennia at best, and didn't ramp up until (like the Islamic Golden Age), the scripture was overruled by progress.

>dump the now completely decoupled from religion framework of humanism and individual liberty?
The original point that OP seems to have made was that the Modern West was founded on Anglo-Franco values, which were a progression of Christian values that emerged during the Colonial Era, the Renaissance and various Western Liberal revolutions. Pointing out that a frame of thought is being hijacked for religious purposes and regressing to a previous and inferior state, does not in turn mean that you need to throw absolutely everything out just to be contrarian, nor does it mean that everyone is on board following a single branch of ideas, like how you obsess over a single book. Pointing out that you don't need the Bible to tell you cannibalism is bad, does not in turn mean that the argument is that the world should regress back to cannibalism to own the libtards christcucks, when the case being made is that there's a natural evolved behavioral avoidance to avoid cannibalism anyways due to the severe health risks incurred (eg Prion Diseases), and that religion is just a pointless middle-man stating the logically, scientifically and instinctually obvious. Take that, criticise it to see if passes a logical shit-test, and apply it to all of morality.
Rather, it's that new facts and understanding have come to light that directly contradict what the current zeitgeist is founded upon. Namely, that we are not spiritually equal under God, the "miracles" of God are embarrassingly primitive / nonsensical and have clear explanations or logical flaws, a book written by Jews + for Jews is there to benefit Jews, we are not scientifically one race / the human race, there is a clear developmental gradient in human evolution, the third world is that way for a reason, and no amount of bookbashing or charitable donations is going to get an Aborigine to ever contribute to global civilisation. Human Equality is ontologically provable bullshit, and is the proliferated crack in the foundations of modernity. It's somewhere between a noble delusion and a cruel joke, that has malformed itself into the variety of offshoot living nightmare paths of thought, all aiming to achieve it's logical conclusion: Equity. Individual Liberty and Agency is a valid concept, but only tenable for a portion of the species (the line drawn being subject to personal opinion, but the concept being undeniable).
The kicker is that I don't think anyone would give a shit if you went to Burkina Faso to spread the word of your Lord, or traveled to Israel to die to help fulfill your eschatological beliefs. It's that you're importing (assuredly Christian) Burkina Faso'ians into our countries to enjoy the products of what you've deluded yourself into thinking is a Christian world (as if they have a right to be here), assuming they will behave because they read the same book of morals as you, and sending billions in other people's tax money over to Israel to bring forth your prophecy. Or in more abrasive terms; Treason, Rape-Murder and Theft. Christendom may have had purpose at one point (whether I believe it or not is irrelevant), but the modern state of it cannot be trusted. At all. And if not you, the people you are blindly defending.

>>165613
It's common sense that women should fulfill their biological roles just like men should.

>>165615
Lad stop flailing like a retard I'm not Christian and you're not going to rile me with image macros and christ bashing. Also please answer the question.

Fuck me such a long worded response just to repaet yourself and ignore the question.

>>165596
>I definitely don't believe there's some laundry list of dos and don'ts to adhere to.
Same
>CQ Radio
I listened to it for awhile too following the links here. Some good, in-depth and thoughtful conversations. The christfags would act so arrogant and argumentative, but then after getting throughly BTFO point by point would throw lil temper tantrums and essentially just go "n-no u" lmao. CQ Radio kicks (kicked?) ass
>the hammer does need to be brought down on ignorant retards who shoot off their mouths thinking they're a lot smarter than they are.
I've had to bring the hammer down many a time. Its always the biggest pussies that are the loudest. Its always the most plugged-in NPCs that chat shit, try to talk about politics with strangers, act insufferable etc.
>I've always been into paranormal subjects
Same
>The people who do so can't seem to come up with an actionable solution to dealing with innate racial differences in a dog-eat-dog world where game theory applies
New Agers think if we all just love each other maaaaaaaaaaaan like demented 60's hippies. The feds promote a lot of disnifo in paranormal and fringe communities for this very purpose, to steer people on the fringe towards being a bunch of mushy gelatinous people with no firm ideals of beliefs besides miscenegation and love maaaaaaan. Send them all to Brighton and Vermont and drop the nuke, lmao. Some people's purpose in this life is just to be an example for others of what not to do.
>are just whistling past the graveyard
I've never heard this phrase before and looked it up. Lul, how apt. Good way of putting it
>I just have appreciation for the gods and stories our ancestors came up with and think the the aesthetics are appealing, too.
Thats good enough for me. Its because of the church we don't have a concise understanding of the ways of old. Mass censorship, scared of the free exchange of ideas, scared of free expression. Just like the media-machine in our times. Sad to think of what all has been lost.
>Too many people seem to believe that once they're dead they'll be guaranteed an existence of blissful lotus eating and not have to worry about being taken advantage of by other beings. I'd rather keep my guard up here and in any possible existence after death
Oh, absolutely. Don't go towards the tunnel of light. I wanna always be in control over myself at all times and not be some other beings bitch. This life if anything, is a reprieve. We're always at war against evil and whatever comes after life is probably going to be more of the same struggle. What if what the abrahamics call demons are just high-level extraterrestials waging war against humanity? They call it a demon and try to ascribe a form to something Lovecraftian that could kill them from sheer shock at knowing what it really is. I kinda see Life and Earth as a proving ground and battlefield.
>I question the motives of anyone who encourages others to engage in "toxic positivity" and completely cast aside wariness and suspicion.
Anyone pushing toxic positivity makes me sick to my stomach. Its a very, very transparent power play. Those people are seeking fresh meat to mindrape and control. Relatedly, anyone trying to act like a mentor and overly preachy about getting you to belief in their beliefs system is trying the same trick. All White countries have been turned by ZOG into open-air prisons.
>"Our differences don't matter. We're all one, man. We all just need to love each other!" Yeah, well, under a monistic framework me and a giant centipede are one, too. That doesn't mean I'm going to want to have anything to do with one. There has to be some level of nuance.
Oneness is pushed by the jews to get us to lower ourselves further down the chain while they consolidate power at the top. Have you seen Hyperborean Research's videos about Eastern Spirituality? Those vids really hammered home for me about the Oneness psyop. I don't wanna come back as an ant or a leaf or a bacteria because of some "beautiful tapestry of All", thats braindead nonsense promoted by the jews to get Whites to de-value and de-humanize themselves. Its a kabbalistic spell, is what it is. Duality, like it or not, is just an inherent part of this reality. Divisions and differences between us are there for very good reasons.
>I think the Christians who promote annihilationism or universal salvation are doing the rest of us a service.
I would agree with that. "Never interrupt your enemy, when they are making a mistake"
>I have older relatives who've bought into the whole nine yards. The Jews are the chosen people, going "witnessing" or on mission trips (or attending religious events elsewhere), race mixing is fine, etc. It's sickening and depressing the way so many of them have been hoodwinked.
I have 2 relatives deep into it too, its sad to see what christianity turns people into. Unthinking golems of the jews. You have my sympathy. I've seen up close what hardcore libtardism turns people into as well. Its shockingly similar. Both antiwhite, Loxist filth, both communist. The NPC programming is just a modified version of the old church programming from ye old days. And I think the French Revolution was a mistake as well, as there is no such thing as equality in this world, nor should there be. Equality is a disgusting ideal.

Is this thread just a big thearapy group for for ex-christains from the bible belt? I'm really getting that particular vibration from this thread.

>>165602
>I'm not entirely sure you can just torch thousands of years if history and not cut out a large chunk of the white man with it.
I think we can include the centuries under the Christian yoke as part of our racial story. Not everything that came out of Christianity was bad or has to go, either, and I'd say even most full-blown pagans will agree with that. There doesn't have to be a big, gaping hole in our history. We can honor our ancestors while rejecting falsehoods that they weren't able to for whatever reason (or in the worst cases, directly pushed knowing it was fake). It also looks to me like we could be in the process of shifting away from traditional religions anyway.
>As a side note any particular moral framework any of you prefer if we're going to dump the now completely decoupled from religion framework of humanism and individual liberty?
I don't know. I think it might be worth it to revisit classical philosophy and see if there's anything worth taking.

To be perfectly honest, I'm more concerned about truth than I am coming up with a viable moral framework. I'm also not comfortable with noble lies. There are going to have to be some shared ideas about appropriate social interactions and behaviors for societies to function smoothly, but I don't necessarily see that as being based on anything objective. My personal moral conduct is based on my own subjective feelings (which is something that seems to be true for most people, but nobody really cares to admit it), and my views on objective morality hinge on the nature of reality itself. That's something I don't feel that I have enough information about. If it turned out that we live in a multiverse where every possible outcome already exists and we're just selecting preexistent outcomes on some level, what would the ethical ramifications of that be? I really don't know. I'm just a bird looking at a computer monitor.

The closest thing I have to a solution is more intentional communities popping up for people to segregate along lines like race, ethics, and worldview. I don't think Return to the Land is enough. I'm talking about many different networked communities that could cooperate with other like-minded community networks with a similar focus. You could have them forming meta-networks to work toward common interests. Each community or community network could have its own specific worldview, with meta-networks consisting of smaller groups coming together on more overarching principles. It seems like it would be easier to do something like that than find some grand unifying moral or religious ideology in this day and age. Pro-whites are a relatively small and fractious group prone to purity spiraling, but if they were part of a broader coalition they would be much more effective. There's an economic axis of capitalism vs. socialism, one of authoritarians vs. libertarians, one of right vs. left (to the extent that there even is a pro-white left), and then a big religious split divided mostly between Christians, irreligious people, and neopagans. There are obviously ones other than those, but the point is that I think it would be like herding cats to try to push some highly specific ideology on everyone.

While I would support using this as a way to ideally gain political power, close the borders, and gradually sterilize or deport nons from the Western world and reestablish ourselves along the old nation state ideals, then another option might be to push for the right to have communities like these across state lines. If we can't get our lands back, then we can build global networks and Jew the Jews and nonwhite hordes. Maybe those guys on 8chan who were itching to build a white separatist settlement in Namibia could do just that and much, much more.

Had to make additional posts because I wrote too much.
>>165651
>I listened to it for awhile too following the links here. Some good, in-depth and thoughtful conversations. The christfags would act so arrogant and argumentative, but then after getting throughly BTFO point by point would throw lil temper tantrums and essentially just go "n-no u" lmao. CQ Radio kicks (kicked?) ass
Unfortunately, the show went downhill when NeedMoreAmalek got pissy about all the annoying Charlie Kirk assassination speculation and left. Not to take away anything from other guys on there like HeadlessGiant, but to me one of the things that made the so show interesting was when you had panel members like NeedMoreAmalek and Gnostic Informant on who were passionate about keeping up with biblical scholarship and could speak in great detail about it and why Christians are wrong. It was like listening to a channel like Mythvision, but you were also hearing from people who knew the score on race and the Jewish Question. Something like that would be even better if the Overton window would shift to the point where you could get prominent writers and scholars on the panel like Mythvision or History Valley does. I've always loved listening to Robert M. Price, but politically he's frankly a philosemitic boomercon pussy who wouldn't be caught dead in a place like that. He went on Adam Green's show before not knowing what he was getting into and called him an antisemite afterwards when Gnostic informant had him on his channel again. Unfortunately, everyone else in the field seems to be further to the left of him.
>New Agers think if we all just love each other maaaaaaaaaaaan like demented 60's hippies. The feds promote a lot of disnifo in paranormal and fringe communities for this very purpose, to steer people on the fringe towards being a bunch of mushy gelatinous people with no firm ideals of beliefs besides miscenegation and love maaaaaaan. Send them all to Brighton and Vermont and drop the nuke, lmao. Some people's purpose in this life is just to be an example for others of what not to do.
They act like they've got the key to changing the world but never seem to be able to make it work. If hippies or New Agers have it all correct, then why are their communities so prone to degrading into chaos. Just look at what happened to Haight-Ashbury in the late '60s. Heroin flooded the district and turned it into a cesspit of bums, drug addicts, violence, and theft. They're also very prone to falling for cult leaders and corrupt gurus, like Charles Manson, Jim Jones, Rajneesh, or Maharishi Mahesh Yogi. It's like they either set no boundaries whatsoever or go completely overboard in fawning over fraudulent "wise men" and becoming their slaves.
>Oh, absolutely. Don't go towards the tunnel of light. I wanna always be in control over myself at all times and not be some other beings bitch. This life if anything, is a reprieve. We're always at war against evil and whatever comes after life is probably going to be more of the same struggle. What if what the abrahamics call demons are just high-level extraterrestials waging war against humanity? They call it a demon and try to ascribe a form to something Lovecraftian that could kill them from sheer shock at knowing what it really is. I kinda see Life and Earth as a proving ground and battlefield.
I do tend to believe something like that is true. That's also one of the reasons I don't believe in worshiping any being. I can't be sure what it is I'm dealing with. With that said, I'm sure there are more positively oriented beings out there too.

I think people would be better off getting into practices like meditation than shackling themselves to beliefs that aren't going to help them at all when they're dead. I think meditating and learning to focus and discipline your mind would be much more beneficial.
>Anyone pushing toxic positivity makes me sick to my stomach. Its a very, very transparent power play. Those people are seeking fresh meat to mindrape and control. Relatedly, anyone trying to act like a mentor and overly preachy about getting you to belief in their beliefs system is trying the same trick. All White countries have been turned by ZOG into open-air prisons.
Exactly.

>Oneness is pushed by the jews to get us to lower ourselves further down the chain while they consolidate power at the top. Have you seen Hyperborean Research's videos about Eastern Spirituality? Those vids really hammered home for me about the Oneness psyop. I don't wanna come back as an ant or a leaf or a bacteria because of some "beautiful tapestry of All", thats braindead nonsense promoted by the jews to get Whites to de-value and de-humanize themselves. Its a kabbalistic spell, is what it is. Duality, like it or not, is just an inherent part of this reality. Divisions and differences between us are there for very good reasons.
The oneness concept seems like a recurrent enough pattern in spiritual experiences that I tend to think there's truth to it. The big problem is that these people tend to go stupidly overboard with it, and I don't think it would be hard to expose the inconsistency or unreasonable impracticality of their position in a discussion with them. Take Tom Campbell, for instance. I remember once reading a comment made in response to something he said in a video, with the commenter saying that they enjoyed "racist" jokes. Campbell's response was something to the effect that you can't advance spiritually with that kind of mindset. Uh… what? I kind of get if someone is sitting around all day making themselves feel like garbage by stewing in hatred, but that would be a complete strawman of what being "racist" is (although it's hard to tell given that the definition of the term shapeshifts to fit whatever idea the eunuch using it is trying to demonize). If being filled with hatred is what "racism" is, then blacks seem to be much more guilty of that than whites. I've heard about U.S. survey results recently that concluded that only about 53% of black respondents thought it was okay to be white. If the shoe were on the other foot, you'd never hear the end of it. Furthermore, why does the "racism" bashing not seem to extend past the species barrier? Why draw the line at humans? Where are the people insisting that socioeconomic disparities are the main reason gorillas aren't building skyscrapers? While there are plenty of animal welfare and animal rights activists out there, I seriously doubt that the majority of them deny that different lifeforms have innately distinct traits and abilities based on their biological makeup. To me that lack of consistency seems to show that the stance is based mainly on false, politically motivated assumptions that downplay how much of a driving force biology is on inequalities in human behavior and personality.
>I have 2 relatives deep into it too, its sad to see what christianity turns people into. Unthinking golems of the jews. You have my sympathy. I've seen up close what hardcore libtardism turns people into as well. Its shockingly similar. Both antiwhite, Loxist filth, both communist. The NPC programming is just a modified version of the old church programming from ye old days.
My relatives are good people, but they've also been completely brainwashed. They came of age in the post-WWII era with all the brainwashing that entails. The monolithic media apparatus was so dominant at that time that it's hard for boomers and members of the Silent Generation to think outside of the mindset that's been drilled into them. If you were a "square," it was pretty normal to get funneled into impotent, race-blind "conservatism" and the dopey religiosity that goes along with that. Pic related. And like Uberboyo has been constantly bringing up in his videos lately, there seems to be a neurological link between religious belief and right-wing political instincts. That's a serious issue with movements like "Christian nationalism": They take healthy particularist drives and reorient them toward spiritual globalism and loyalty to nebulous "values" and propositions. I don't really believe my relatives would be "based" (racial honesty has tended to be a third rail even for secular people brought up in the post WWII decades) if it wasn't for their Christian beliefs, but it's certainly not helping anything.

I think the desire for a stable or comforting worldview also plays a role in pushing them in that direction.
>And I think the French Revolution was a mistake as well, as there is no such thing as equality in this world, nor should there be. Equality is a disgusting ideal.
It went too far, but I'm no fan of the ancien regime or similar monarchies. I'm not against a certain level of authoritarianism if the situation calls for it, though. Look at what Lee Kuan Yew did for Singapore. I'd still prefer something more free for white populations on a long-term basis. I also like a relative degree of equality among members of a given nation but not one that excludes individual merit. "Colorblind meritocracy" is still obviously retarded and unworthy of consideration.

>>165665
The problem is truth is not absolute empierial metric to be uncovered, truths tend to be unique to peoples (alot like moral framworks). You would need to find a common agreed upon set of rules to have any sort of social cohesion. I personally also like Greek virtue ethics; however for the post part what your advocate would represent a weakening of white people by atomising them into small niche interest groups that would probably fight amoung each other as much as union with one another. It just sounds like HRE 2.0 larp edition.

So a couple random responses to anons:

Oneness is the concept that we are all in a way one with the universe and will return to the one and the all, ever watched fullmetal alchemest? Its a Greek, Neoplatonistic, and Alchemistic Philopshy that comes from European thought.

It actually doesn't have any Jewish Subversion at its root but its not surprising that Christians, that poach Neoplatonism to fix their broken non-existent metaphysics and to graft the concept of the ONE (the spirit of the universe who is the all and one, AKA GOD) and his power onto Yaweh.

It is no surprise the kikes would try to use the Christianized format of oneness to make the goyim take rapefugees.

I have noticed that a lot of anons here seem to dislike traditional truly right-wing states with proper aristocracies and Kings, know that this is the default and proper state of society when not subverted, also know that it took several thousand years for the Jews to subvert traditional Europe, they conquered America founded on enlightenment values in less than 30 years.

My main issue with modern right-wing movements is their reliance on the mass-man, the same mass-man that pretends he was always against Fascism and National-Socialism after the fact. We need a proper bedrock to our society if we want it to continue, the main flaw the West had was that Christianity screwed up its Metaphysics, we were successful in SPITE of this. It would be best to establish a 5-cast society with Kings, Warriors, Priests, Artisans/Professionals, and Farmers, with NO slave cast. a society which moves and thinks properly like a body, and a society that can properly manage its underclass by allotting those unable to be a part of said castes.

We can't rely on the Mass man so we need to properly create a Set of Elites in a way that holds us with divine authority above the underclass, ideally we wouldn't want an underclass at all but with today's world that just isn't possible. Plato's republic brings up the importance of the noble lie that unites a people, I know that many of us here believe in the supernatural to an extent but have been brow-beaten by modern soyence and the truths shown on the internet, and it makes it impossible for many of us to truly believe in a spiritual tradition, but thanks to Christianities success we live in a world that requires mass-religion to be cohesive, ideally we would take What is left of Catholic Institutions and fully paganize them, maintaining God, and the decent Saints of the Church, but slowly re-adding deities and decent men of European history. The reason I select Catholicism as a base for creating a new religion theoretically is it is already the largest and most paganized of Christian denominations that once dominated Europe. The traditions have also been better retained that the protestant ones which gave rise to enlightenment values, the french revolution, and a lot of the terrible modern problems we have today. I am not against all enlightenment values when it comes to scientific stuff but for the most part the logical conclusions of a lot the enlightenment lead to post-religious christcuck morality and communism/Neo-liberalism.

I believe that Hitler attempted to do this, albeit in a very neutral, and less religious way to satisfy his Neo-Pagan, Pure Natsoc, and Christian followers, we essentially need to take his and Emperor Julian's Efforts to the next level. Of course this is all theoretical but its necessary for a healthy civilization.

Society must be Headed by a King/Emperor, one representing, Solar Masculine energy, a living avatar of the nation and the people, consecrated by Lunar feminine energized priest who are given legitimacy to profess and teach morals by the king, and who are defended by him and the Warrior Caste. It should be noted that the King and the Warrior caste Knights in recent history for Europe must be the ones to lead society, not priests, the Catholic Church lead an almost thousand year endless cold-war against the divine rights of its kings and warriors which led to their alliance with the (((merchant)))-subclass of the artisans, and eventually lead to the predicament we have today. One could argue it is in the Priests nature to rebel if they are not shown their place, I would argue that the semetic-root of Catholicism was the main reason for their attack on European Imperial power the way the Church shattered the HRE even though it was made to defend the Church in the first place, classic christcuck moment

Honestly a part of me is still pretty attached to modern movements in the sense that I feel that National Socialism and Fascism got a lot right, but I think modern right-wing movements need to learn from Imperial Japan and Germany and have a proper Caste system with built to last. If the people believe the Emperor is the God of his people like the Pharaoh, the Roman Emperor, or even the Japanese Emperor is than they are more likely to have long-term belief in the nation. Hitler was literally an extraordinary man, a Caesar of his time but the main problem with Caesars is if they die without a successor or a proper plan than everything they build falls apart, Hitler certainly had a plan, the Caesar of our times/Caesar candidates will not. I actually think North Korea took the right-turn by imbuing the Kim Family with divinity, the North Korean State will not fall apart any time soon. Part of the reason why North Koreans are more likely to want to die for their country is they feel that they are a part of something bigger than themselves, and that divinity of the Kim Family makes up for the lack of the whole larger than life figure that was someone like Hitler.

Another I would say is I can't tell whether having a Royal Family or an elected King would be better, both have drawbacks and benefits, personally I think a Royal Family is better in the sense that they are raised to be Kings, normal people but as rulers and are thus easier for the people to accept, if there is a meritocratic way of obtaining kingship it may lead to (((reformers))) and subversives that could restart modern society or super-Caesars that leave voids that make the people disappointed with their next ruler.

If anyone is inclined to tell me why they think a modern system would do entirely better than what I propose which is more of a hybrid-system between something like Fascism/Natsoc and a Traditional-Caste Based Monarchy I would like to hear it. Also I will say the idea with proper castes is you are essentially trying to eugenically create classes of people suited for the best jobs. It was said that the Ancient Aryans saw orderly ant colonies and tried to partially base their societies off of their proper separation of roles.

>>165667
>pic
now you know why jews hate centrism

>>165902
I remember having to read his book about the holobunga but I can't remember a damn thing about it

>165702
brown